Flat Spot

cornerstore
2008 February 11 14:23:19 
Who are they kidding in their thinking that a change of jockey will erase a flat spot from Miss Finland's recent on-track performances?
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8 Comments

peeping fawn

2008 February 12 12:40:53

Miss Finland is one paced and simply not good enough.

glencoe

2008 February 12 13:52:34

And another thing....

Lindsay park doesn't "replace" jockeys.
They fire them permanently. Hayes's kept
Gauci and the Clarkes alive for years, but
chose to overlook their deficiencies.
We'll know when Hayes wants Williams relaced,
because his arse'll be down the road for good.

Hitchcock

2008 February 12 15:29:45


That’s the thing, isn’t it?

Williams has been replaced and blame has been apportioned accordingly.

But I’m pretty sure Williams isn’t the one who wanted her set for unsuitable races that she couldn’t win in the spring. And I’m pretty sure Williams isn’t the one who wanted her set for the unsuitable Lightning whilst her golden chance to win an Orr Stakes went begging.

I’m also pretty sure the trainer didn’t make these decisions of his own accord either.

Nevertheless, someone had to be made scapegoat and Messara and Jones have voted Williams ‘it’. A far easier job for their massive egos than acknowledging the egg on their own faces.

nigeltufnel

2008 February 12 17:37:14

Spot on, Hitch.

Nige

Dancing At Ascot

2008 February 12 12:25:33

The bottom line Tigerish is that they simply have no idea. She has been so good to them as a great two and three year old but the connections just can't handle that she is just an ordinary open group one horse who may pinch a group one if she got everything her way.

tigerrish

2008 February 11 22:08:20

Interesting that the ultimate target is mares races in the US..........whats wrong with the filly's and mares races here? They bypassed a perfectly good race last Sat that was right up her alley and would have told the owners exactly where she was at, the Lightning did nothing to enhance here chances in future WFA races at all.

nigeltufnel

2008 February 11 19:54:39

Another chapter in the MF saga.

Firstly, in the interests of balance, can we separate 'the horse' from 'the hype'?

I'll begin by being upfront & admit I backed her as an early 2yo, and had a large win on her in the Slipper (plus I was on an end of season cricket trip at the time & tipped her to half a dozen or so non-punters, thus earning instant legend status), and thus have had a soft spot for her ever since.

She won her Oaks on class (compared to the field she faced that day), but IMO has been repeatedly found out beyond 1600m in open company ever since; and she is a major victim of that four letter 'h' word.

All the talk of her going o/s, going for the Melbourne Cup, and the constant conjecture surrounding her has become rather tedious.

Without intimate knowledge of the relationship between owners and trainer in this case, I had hoped that she would be given the opportunity to display her talent at suitable distances this preparation.

IMO the Lightning was a mistake. I would liked to have seen her first up in the Newmarket, where she would have been a far more realistic hope. I hope they stick to 1400 - 1600 from here on in; races like the Ryder and/or the Coolmore IMO would be perfect for her - if she hasn't been over-raced by then.

Now they are giving Craig the flick. Having followed her since her win down the straight on Derby Day as a 2yo (beating Tipungwuti), I cannot remember Craig slaughtering her even once (Can't say the same for Lisa Cropp). In fact, I would put the majority of her defeats down to two factors: (a) wet tracks; and (b) being placed in races beyond her scope.

For the horse's sake, I hope she has a win left in her somewhere.

I can't say I feel quite as charitable towards some of her connections.

Over to you, folks.


Nige

bradmcmanus

2008 February 11 21:21:54

She has only seemingly had her 'flat spot' against the A graders.

These horses have an exceptional turn of foot, far better than those which she was beating up on as a 3yo. She is running as well as she always has but is against superior horses. Her best win, first up in the spring, was good but she had the perfect run against Harada who was leading (and a sitting duck as he was being trained to stay when he was a miler) and el segundo who was very fresh and last - with a bigger goal in his sights.

She is also a big mare who seems to corner badly at the Valley, so my hard earned will be on Apache smashing her on Saturday if he starts.

mcgarret

2008 February 11 21:59:06

Mette makes the Netherlands look like the Himalayas.

McGarret out

Hitchcock

2008 February 11 22:11:29

Always amused by the phrase "flat spot" in relation to Miss Finland.

In any other horse, the inability to quicken when they go for home is referred to as the horse being a bit "one-paced".

glencoe

2008 February 12 11:57:32

Wonder if there isn't another "trainer"
throwing darts from behind a bush?

I suppose David Hayes would like to send the
hounds in, but the outcome could be too embar-
rassing for business. It wouldn't be the fir-
st time Craig Williams has taken a dive in his
Caliban role.

the mookstas no 1

2008 February 12 13:01:32

Weren't the knives out for Dance Hero after his two year old season as well? He turned out OK, didn't he?

And as for an "ordinary open Group 1 performer" Dancing At Ascot - isn't that an oxymoron? I would have thought any open Group 1 performer is a touch above ordinary.

She's a 4 year old mare who was trained somewhat inappropriately in the eyes of everybody last preparation - and now that she's being trained as a sprinter she is being trained inappropriately again? What exactly was wrong with her Lightning run? What do you people want??? She's had one run back and people are ready to string her up!!

And changing a jockey is something that happens day in day out, week after week. Every trainer has done it from time to time. He has had a super run on her yet hasn't been able to snag a win lately. Has he done anything wrong? No.

You may do everything right with a woman, but not get to the boudoir. Sometimes it's nobody's fault, it just happens.

I'm not writing her off and I'm not castigating the connections - just yet.

glencoe

2008 February 12 13:56:30

Sorry, mooks, didn't mean to implicate
you in all the hoo-haa.

cheers,

Glen

cornerstore

2008 February 12 15:37:04

Hayes kept Gauci going for years lol. .

You fool.

greyshot

2008 February 12 17:58:43

Slim,

Is it true you got into David Hayes' ear about Williams ?

I have heard reports that you have been spending a lot of time in the sauna lately ???

slim

2008 February 12 18:21:14

greyshot.
Not guilty your honour!!

glencoe

2008 February 12 13:42:40

mooksta...

Do you honestly believe Hayes wanted
Williams replaced?

And show where Miss Finland was trained
innapropriately last time in. She won the
Memsie 1st up, then ran 2nd in the Underwood.
There would be a hundred spring champs that
have followed the same trail, and culminated
in Cox Plate defeat. Did anyone say D.A. Hayes made mistakes backing Foo up in the
Mackinnon? But he got bagged for doing so
with a sounder horse.

Arrowfield want everything. Simple as that.
They have found a horse for the first time in
their history that has held up from 2 till 4,
and are pressuring her to do things that are
beyond her. Should David Hayes have said:

Let's freshen her up after the Memsie, and
we'll run her against Divine Madonna in a mile
race, or Gold Edition in a sprint. Meanwhile,
the lowest bunch of middle-distance wfa horses
IN OUR HISTORY get to compete for millions in
jokes like the Cox Plate and Caulfield Cup.

Yeah, i can really see Messara going along
with that. It would have been all the ammo
he needed to get her into his own stable.

Torpedo Punt

2008 February 11 21:48:11

LMAO at Andrew Bensley referring to her as a champion mare on Retro the other morning!

What a hoot..


Torp..

Rex

2008 February 11 21:36:24

Im still not convinced either way about her. Cannot blame connections for a change of rider, occasionally it does make a difference and at least they are trying something. Ive always said that she was trained completely upside down, wether that is the owners influence or a Hayes mistake, who knows....but one thing I do know, there are alot of very good and even champion fillies who do not make it as mares.....a trully hope she is not one of them.


cheers

Da G Show

2008 February 11 21:16:38

Williams slaughtered her in the Manifold!

and LOL blaming Lisa Cropp - simply not good enough.

slim

2008 February 12 09:39:47

I'm a big supporter of Craig Williams and feel sorry that he has lost the ride this time but there has never been a rider that has not been jocked off something special during his career so don't feel too bad Craig.
In answer to the g show's comment that he slaughtered her in the Manifold! The g is probably talking through his pocket as usual but all jockeys make mistakes and are not perfect, just like you g!
I agree with Rex that the idea of trying someone different in the saddle has worked on many occasions and probably will on Saturday.

Dancing At Ascot

2008 February 11 19:34:14

The connections have absolutely no idea. They had a great two and 3y0 filly. Once she hit the open class horses she has been found to be just ordinary.

Craig Williams has ridden her almost prefectly apart from that one 1000 Guineas lead up race a couple of years ago.

They must have short memories these blokes fair dinkum. Obviously don't remember that arguably her best win the Golden Slipper was acheived on the back of a brilliant Williams ride.

Williams gave the morons a timely reminder of his ability today wish a slashing ride on Offenbach in the Hobart Cup.

Can't wait till they realise that she just isn't much good and hopefully Williams is on the back of the horse who smashes her on saturday and in the futurity.

(Miss Finland - the most over-rated horse in Australia)

the urger

2008 February 11 18:57:42

Have they tried silicone?

Mr Lister

2008 February 11 17:20:47

It's got nothing to do with a flat spot mate. It's called being not good enough for the races she has been placed in.

brownie

2008 February 11 16:10:15


A change of trainer would be a better idea.

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